tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2799914692887174209.post6404365422953780874..comments2024-01-15T21:30:40.609+03:00Comments on Istanbul's Stranger: Sarıyer SporStrangerhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/09933997864575809110noreply@blogger.comBlogger10125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2799914692887174209.post-8264826333324642232011-10-25T17:14:48.365+03:002011-10-25T17:14:48.365+03:00There are obviously genetic/hormonal etc. differen...There are obviously genetic/hormonal etc. differences and their effects might manifest themselves in various ways but I highly doubt whatever those ways are, they are what customs dictate they are. Mixed sports, co-ed schools, equal-ish opportunity help get the point across through our thick cranial bones by providing personal experience. If I didn't have a sis, classmates, friends and colleagues who were better than me (both in evident aptitude and accomplishment) in what some claim are male things (math, science, engineering etc.) probably no amount of well-meant indoctrination would have convinced me that conventional thinking was flawed. <br /><br />You are right about competitive sports that involve physical contact. If a referee is truly needed to call/stop the fouling involved, the players are probably too nasty and sportsmanship is there in name only. OTOH, such interactions do exist and are perhaps inevitable. I know I have done somewhat permanent damage to at least one person (stitches around the eyebrow) through retaliatory fouling that didn't quite work the way I thought/hoped it would. (Shameless excuse: I hoped to get the guy in his solar plexus and didn't know he was shoving me w/o jumping for the rebound.) Had it been a formally refereed game, many fouls would have been called before it got to the point where I lost my head.Bulent Murtezaoglunoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2799914692887174209.post-32695184517131871992011-10-24T23:40:17.228+03:002011-10-24T23:40:17.228+03:00Ah, my flippancy has caused me to stumble into, I ...Ah, my flippancy has caused me to stumble into, I think, the same trap my grandmothers did when they were mocking the bra-less feminists-- is it male-ness that keeps the White Guelphs at the Black Guelphs throats, or would the women have participated more if there weren't other social constraints keeping them at home? To say it was anything other than social constraints (or babies) is the same as saying women are somehow genetically marked to stay at home and be nice and clean and not swear and not go to football matches and raise hell with the boys.<br /><br />Which I'm not entirely comfortable with. For me to feel like the whole football violence thing is a bunch of silliness could just be socialization and I wouldn't know.<br /><br />Now, in mixed sports, I think a lot of women know sneaky physical fouling is one of the tools in our pockets when the men are usually bigger, stronger, and faster, and loathe to "hit a girl." When I played water polo in high school (one of three girls in the region, apparently), I definitely abused the right of sneaky, underwater fouling because I knew the boys (mostly) wouldn't hit back, and if they did, the ref would come down harder on them. If I had to get the ball from someone bigger, stronger, and faster than me (which was mostly everyone), a bit of "surprise!" was my only tactic and it totally made them drop the ball.<br /><br />When I played women's water polo in college (intramural, mind you-- not competitive), I came out of those games far more bruised and bloodied than I ever did with the boys. I'll never know if the boys played like that with each other (but not with me), or if the girls were just meaner, but my dislike of the whole thing is one of many reasons I'm not an athlete of any kind. Also I pretty much suck at sports.Strangerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09933997864575809110noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2799914692887174209.post-13133983517546796062011-10-24T17:53:23.464+03:002011-10-24T17:53:23.464+03:00I don't know if it is primarily a male thing. ...I don't know if it is primarily a male thing. It makes [conventional?] sense for it to be that way but I have some anecdotal evidence to the contrary. One thing I noticed when playing (mixed) soccer in the US was how physical the women would get. Shoulders hits to the rib cage (easy to do when you are 2/3rd my size) dangerous dives etc. all came from women. I remember trying to figure out whether I should keep my own game clean or turn Turkish-style <i>cirkef</i> myself the first time it happened to me. You are talking about fandom, of course, but it carries over as it does in other things. It may have something to do with the nature of the thinking/approach than the sex of the subject. (I deliberately avoided saying 'gender' here since, perhaps, it can be argued that those are male-ish things even when done by women. Dunno. Beyond my depth.) Nationalism works that way too. On the issue of the questionable things uttered on national TV during the quake coverage, at least two female anchors got into trouble for example. For something that ties the city-state thing with female fandom, here's a female announcer more or less inciting street violence between people from Trabzon living Bursa and Bursa fans: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T0IJ4QIpSsABulent Murtezaoglunoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2799914692887174209.post-57658794600805664222011-10-24T17:05:34.318+03:002011-10-24T17:05:34.318+03:00As for fandom (having just watched a bit of that v...As for fandom (having just watched a bit of that video), it's my theory that football fandom has taken the place in people's (dare I say males') hearts of medieval city-state skirmishing, and that professional sports just fill the gladiator hole, though perhaps more humanely.Strangerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09933997864575809110noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2799914692887174209.post-56801854957498960782011-10-24T16:59:44.227+03:002011-10-24T16:59:44.227+03:00It's my theory that basketball has overtaken b...It's my theory that basketball has overtaken baseball in popularity in the US mostly because there aren't many large enough open spaces in cities to get an impromptu baseball game going (a vacant lot, for example), where all you need for a pick up game of basketball is a bit of concrete and a net. <br /><br />Football (soccer) has always been a middle class (and up) sport in the US anyway, and was hardly popular until the late 70s or early 80s, and then it was only kids in organized leagues playing on rented fields. It's only that those kids have grown up now that the sport endures somehow. I don't think I've ever seen American kids playing soccer in the street or in whatever little space they could find...Strangerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09933997864575809110noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2799914692887174209.post-38251044045608508402011-10-23T20:55:06.987+03:002011-10-23T20:55:06.987+03:00Well a look at fan videos shows fandom really isn&...Well a look at fan videos shows fandom really isn't about the game. <a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uAao3IkDvqI" rel="nofollow">This</a> for example. That could have been about any mass movement of any sort -- the game seems incidental. <br /><br />It is different when you are playing though. I think the attraction is that it doesn't take and gear to play and the skills required to enjoy playing it are minimal. If we had hoops in our neighbourhoods basketball would have been just as popular here (and perhaps elsewhere).Bulent Murtezaoglunoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2799914692887174209.post-59554661290172911662011-10-23T19:57:06.089+03:002011-10-23T19:57:06.089+03:00I have to say, though, I don't mind one bit th...I have to say, though, I don't mind one bit the 22 grown men racing around and doing their calisthenics every evening... Too bad they don't play shirts and skins here!Strangerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09933997864575809110noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2799914692887174209.post-64414261834278919492011-10-22T14:42:54.720+03:002011-10-22T14:42:54.720+03:00I've never really got football despite the fac...I've never really got football despite the fact that the beautiful game was invented in England and remains a national obsession (and the national team remains a national disgrace). 22 grown men running around a muddy field in the depths of winter chasing a leather ball. What's that about?Jack Scotthttp://www.perkingthepansies.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2799914692887174209.post-88725087502963929992011-10-21T19:59:25.134+03:002011-10-21T19:59:25.134+03:00Hee!Hee!Strangerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09933997864575809110noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2799914692887174209.post-74214625003341561922011-10-21T15:15:05.662+03:002011-10-21T15:15:05.662+03:00Oh yes, friendly messages on banners -- especially...Oh yes, friendly messages on banners -- especially for the visiting fans -- are the norm here. Here's <a href="http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2131/2045813263_20896f96a4_o.jpg" rel="nofollow">an example</a>.Bulent Murtezaoglunoreply@blogger.com